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  • #23195
    GetstrengthGetstrength
    Participant
    #23988
    andrew
    Guest

    Does this team do any good ?

    Many shoulder, back injuries ?

    The program is very poorly balanced….

    21 sets of vertical pressing on Tuesday…..thats so silly I wont dwell on it.

    No rest days …. with a huge number of sets per workout…..

    What do other people think ???

    #23987
    disi
    Guest

    in reference to your question about the crusaders, they have won the super 14 more than any other team in the competition, they house international players such as dan carter and richie mccaw and the strength and conditioning coach is ashley jones who you can ask specific questions on this site.

    i assume the reason for 5 continuous days is because it is set out for professionals and because of this its like a full working week but you could spread out the programme to suit your bodies own rest needs. the reason for so many vertical pressing movements/sets is because it is far more specific for rugby than horizontal pressing, most movements e.g. lineout lifting, hand offs etc are all done verticallr or on the feet. i personally when trying out this workout changed one of the shoulder pressing movements to a standing one arm barbell push (which can be used with or without the getstrength commando equipment – take a look at the equipment for a video on the movement i talking about). https://www.getstrength.com/training/GS-Commando

    I believe the amount of sets is fine due to the difference in rep ranging from 3-8, for rest time between sets i used 60 seconds between the sets involving 6-8 reps but between 2 minutes and 2 minutes 30 seconds for the 3 reps.

    just a few of my personal opinions on this programme but i used it for the latter part of my off-season training and saw great increases in size and strength with the only adjustment being that one movement.

    #23979
    ashley
    Guest

    Perhaps the reason I use more overhead pressing is the fact, is that it was once stated that before the almost universal use of the bench press, there were hardly any shoulder related injuries from weight traininig but since the bench press has been used as the go to for upper body strength there have been an increase in in the prevalence of injuries to raotator cuff and related muscualature, plus I really like free standing movements, since we do play game on our feet after all, cheers, ashley

    #23980
    ashley
    Guest

    Cheers for that Andrew, appreciate your thoughts this is one of many programs that we use, a gradual increase in loading of over a number of years, obviously it would not be applied to a beginner or any one with a small training age, but thanks for your feedback, ashley

    #23986
    nissec
    Guest

    Hey Ashley,
    I’ve just got a few questions about the off season program for the crusaders:

    What kind of strongman exercises do you guys use with tabata intervals?

    What core exercises does the team use with the core circuit and how is the circuit set out?

    Also with the monday session what are the set and rep ranges for the power cleans and the squats?

    Thanks,
    Charlie

    #23981
    ashley
    Guest

    Hi there, with the strongman Tabata we will use mostly tyre flips, yoke walk, sled drag or pull, or conan’s wheel, with the Monday workout it would look like this:

    1 x Lower Body Strength

    Select exercises from each of the following categories, use the same exercise for 3 weeks then change the exercise and repeat the 3 week progression

    Size group

    Lower: Week 1 – 5,4,3,2,1 x 4 Week 2 – 4 x 6 Week 3 – 2 x 5, 3 x 3

    or strength group

    3 sets each exercises with the following reps:

    Week 1 – 6,5,4 Week 2 – 5,4,3 Week 3 – 4,3,2

    2 x Full Body exercise

    1 x Squat or Single Leg

    1 x Hamstring/Lower Back

    and for the core training it would either be complete 100 reps of your selection or like pavel suggests do 3 – 5 sets of 3 – 5 exercises 3 – 5 days per week of the following:

    Core Training:

    After each workout out, select from the following options and do a core circuit, for 10 minutes total time:

    Suit case Dead Lifts, Rollouts, Swiss Ball Leg Raises, Turkish Get Ups, Full Body Twist, Bicycle, Sprinter’s Sit Up, Boxer’s Sit Up, Rainbows, Swiss Ball Sit Up & Throw Med Ball, Russian Twist on Back Extension, Cable Wood Chops

    Cheers ashley

    #23989
    drlukemccabe
    Guest

    Hi Ashley,

    firstly theres some great stuff here! Im presently playing semi pro rugby, aged 30 though and on the wing.. so am really looking to increase my speed and power..

    at the moment we are 8 weeks out from when our season starts, and Im focusing alot on core, plyometrics and speed training. Ive also just ordered some bands as like the look of that training.

    My question is, with 8 weeks out, I really want to make a huge impact this season.. What sort of program should I be looking at to increase my speed, power and agility?

    Further, Ive been looking up the tabata workouts you mention in the crusaders pre season sheet, but must admit really dont know the exercises you are talking about, can you please explain them in black and white or guide me to somewhere where I can look them up myself. do you just do one set of the tabata exercises? IE: four minutes or do you do more or do you look to increase the sets?

    also is the cantebury training programme split into morning/afternoon sessions, or just one session? what sort of rest times do you recommend between sets?

    all help much appreciated

    thanks Luke

    #23982
    ashley
    Guest

    Hi Luke, with 8 weeks to go, I would be concentrating on integrating speed work into game specific work as well, say ball in hand chase drills are particularly good, one we do regularly is in 3’s, a defender on the 22 metre line a pairt of players on the goal line facing the same way, front player has the ball he is held by the jersey at hip level by his partner (or use a sprint harness if you have access to such) the back man gives enough resistance so that the front man has to lean into the sprint and drive with legs and free arm he releases him after 5 – 10 metres of resisted running and then the defender pushes up, the player with the ball draws and passes on the defender releasing the trailing runner (the original resistor) and then both turn and try and run him down before he gets out to the half way line.

    Plyometric work: 4 x 50 metre bound with walk through to far end, 4 x 22m double leg jumps then sprint to the half way line walk to far end, if you have a high hurdle then a single hurdle jump and then sprint out 30 metres walk slowly back repeat x 6

    Here are 2 examples of speed workouts I would do with you:

    Session 1:

    Full Movement Warm up 10 minutes

    Ladders – forward series

    Hurdles – 2 x march, 2 x skip, 2 x run 10m accelerate

    Plyos – choose 2 from below

    10 x MB throw sprint 30 m

    Double leg jumps 5 x 5 10m sprint

    Repeat hurdle jumps 5 x 5 10m sprint

    Alactate Power

    2 x 4 x 20m build 30m fly

    Session 2:

    Full Movement Warm up 10 minutes

    Ladders – lateral series

    Hurdles – lateral series

    Harnesses – lateral series release

    Plyos choose 2 of below

    double leg jumps 5 x 5 sprint

    low hurdle jumps 5 x 5 sprint

    Power Skip 5 x 40m, 4 x 50m Bound

    Max. Velocity choose one based on how you are feeling

    6 x 30m

    6 x 40m

    6 x 50m

    As per Tabata exercise choices it is probably easier to go to you tube or google up the exercise and then you will have a video reference of the movement, we will finish a session with 8 – 10 x 20 seconds work/10 seconds rest, cheers, hope it helps, ashley

    #23990
    drlukemccabe
    Guest

    Hi Ashley,

    thats fab thanks! just quick one, shall I continue with weights the way Im doing them, very similar to crusaders workout you have for offseason? or shall I be starting to change all that as the season’s kick off comes closer? If so, what sort of things should I be changing?

    thanks again

    Luke

    #23983
    ashley
    Guest

    Hey there Luke, I would stay with the current program until you are starting to play trial matches and then go back to a full body strength on Monday or Tuesday and a full body power plus upper body on a thursday basd on a saturday game, go well, ashley

    #23991
    drlukemccabe
    Guest

    hi ashley

    could you please give me an example of this type of workout then, including sets and reps etc… have read some of the other posts and a litle confused on some of them like 5,4,3,2,1 x 2 etc…? and time you should have inbetween each set etc..

    I’d probably aim for speed session on the monday and then full body strength on tues with full body power thurs and upper body attached also…

    could you also advise when to do other speed or plyo sessions, or would you integrate them together on the monday session collectively, starting with pure speed and then doing some of explosive stuff and plyos? also, do you think it would be enough rest from sat game to get a full benficial speed session on the monday or shall I split monday with upper body strength, then speed tues morning and lower body strength in afternoon?

    alot to answer I know, all your help most appreciated!

    thanks

    Luke

    #23984
    ashley
    Guest

    Hi Luke I hope this will assist you, cheers, ashley

    could you please give me an example of this type of workout then, including sets and reps etc… have read some of the other posts and a litle confused on some of them like 5,4,3,2,1 x 2 etc…? and time you should have inbetween each set etc..

    This is a type of extended set cluster style or rest/pause method, there is a 10 to 15 second rest in between each group of reps, and I use 80 – 85% for the load, same weight all the way through the set, so in reality you end up performing 15 reps with a load you would usually be able to get 5 to 7 out normally in a straight rep fashion. Usually 2 to 3 minutes in between sets and often we will super set as well.

    Full Body Strength

    1 x Olympic(Power Snatch from floor)

    1 x Squat(Bulgarian Sprinter’s Squat)

    1 x Hamstring/Lower Back (Glute Ham Raise)

    1 x Upper Body Push and Pull (Push Press & Weighted Chins)

    In season I will usually periodise over 3 weeks then change the movements and go back to week 1, usually 1 – 2 minutes between sets:

    Week 1: 6,5,4

    Week 2: 5,4,3

    Week 3: 4,3,2

    If I were to split this I would do as follows:

    Lower Body Strength

    1 x Olympic(Power Snatch from floor)

    1 x Squat(Bulgarian Sprinter’s Squat)

    1 x Hamstring/Lower Back (Glute Ham Raise)

    Select one additional exercise from any of the 3 categories above.

    Upper Body Strength

    1 x Upper Body Push and Pull- vertical emphasis (Push Press & Weighted Chins)

    1 x Upper Body Push and Pull – horizontal emphasis (Bench Press & Bent Over Row)

    Maybe use 1 exercise grouping for strength and the next for size and alternate these each week.

    Week 1: 12,10, 8

    Week 2: 10,8,6

    Week 3: 8,6,4

    I’d probably aim for speed session on the monday and then full body strength on tues with full body power thurs and upper body attached also..

    Possibly Speed on the Monday morning and full body strength either straight after or later in the day would work as well or split it and do the lower body program on Monday and the Upper Body on the Tuesday and combine power and upper body on the Thursday as you have written..

    could you also advise when to do other speed or plyo sessions, or would you integrate them together on the monday session collectively, starting with pure speed and then doing some of explosive stuff and plyos? also, do you think it would be enough rest from sat game to get a full benficial speed session on the monday or shall I split monday with upper body strength, then speed tues morning and lower body strength in afternoon?

    I would include some field based plyo work with your speed session on Monday and then do some gym based plyos with your power work on the Thursday, I think the question will be answered by how you feel, you may have to push it all to Tuesday and reverse what I wrote earlier, do the upper body Monday and speed and lower strength on Tuesday. My players have options like that, to ensure they get what is best for them.

    Hope this helps you out, happy to oblige. I will outline In season option in a another post shortly.

    alot to answer I know, all your help most appreciated!

    thanks

    #23992
    drlukemccabe
    Guest

    just one more thing Ashley do you tend to stick to just 3 sets per session then for horizontal/vertical push and pull sessions?

    after working hard utilising alot of the stuff in your crusaders pre-season (8 sets, then 6,then 4) for like shoulders etc, it now seems a little…?

    thanks for your continual input

    Luke

    #23985
    ashley
    Guest

    Hi Luke, thanks for your post, by all means add an extra set if you feel you are under done, but my feeling is that you want to do the ,imi,u, to get a result at this time of the year not how much can the body tolerate, since I want you fizzing on game day, I have had player’s set personal life time bests in the weight room in finals week just by doing 3 sets on each exercise throughout the season, so maximise recovery to maximise results, cheers, ash

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